BIG PROBLEM NEED HELP FAST !!!

[courchaine]

I've just installed a Je 10.5:1 piston, kibblewhite valves springs,hotcams stage 2 before the rebuild everything was fine but now the starter can't turn the engine over and the relay is clicking really fast. I thought it was the starter so I rebuilded it and tested everything even did a shunt test and now the starter is fine. But it won't start the engine I removed magneto side cover and everything is fine (one way, starter gear) checked valves adjustement to see if it was too loose but everything is fine. checked resistance in every wire on the starting system and everything was fine. checked the relay and it was fine too even tested another one and it did the same. I know that my battery is bad but I connect the charger at 10amps and it did the same. So now i'm pretty sure that theres is something too tight on that engine so it make it harder to turn.

Anybody have an idea of what could make this ?
Can a Kodiak Battery can make this thing work ?


any help would be really appreciated

thanks

Max

 

[yamarider]

If you know your battery is bad, why not start by replacing it? A 10 amp charger isn't enough to start a quad...

If the battery doesn't fix it, i'd start checking electrical connections. Make sure the cable connections on the battery terminals, the starter, the solenoid,and the ground are all tight, and the contact is clean. Don't just look at the outside, unbolt the cable and make sure there isn't corrosion between the cable and terminals, and if in doubt, clean the connection with a wire brush so it's silver and shiny, and throw some dielectric grease on it to keep it from getting corroded and contaminated again.

 

[courchaine]

it won't even start when I put 75amps. But if I just unplug the starter from the engine and press the start button it will turn fine.

 

[ogener]

Maybe there is to much compression or drag in the engine that is not letting the starter to do what it needs to.

 

[jasonp]

I'd go with Greg on this one, some great info there.
I would jump accross the solenoid and check to see if the engine will start or go right to the starter.
A lot of people have 10.2:1, 10:5.1 and 12:1 compression as well as strokers. The stock starting system from what I've heard and found from my own findings works great.
I'm going to guess it's a connection on the battery (charger and battery), battery itself or solenoid.

 

[courchaine]

Selnoid is ok i've tested it. There is no resistance in any wire. i'll check the connection tomorrow. But the thing that I don't understand is that if I just unplug the starter from the engine and press the start button the starter turn fine.and when i've opened the magneto cover and started it the engine really really slow on intake and exhaust cycle and then turn fast. Also when I remove the sparkplug it turns fine. really weird.

so starting sytem consist of : batteries,wires,selenoid,starter motor.... is there any other things ???


thanks a lot

Max

 

[jasonp]

cam timing..
It turns over ok because there is no amperage being pulled or very little when turning the engine over with no "load" When you put a load on the starter then it draws more amperage... when this happens voltage drops and then the solenoid can not say closed as there is not enough voltage to hold the solenoid down in the closed postion. This is where you get that rapid on/off sound as the solenoid is closing and opening very fast.

 

[jasonp]

sounds to me like it's more of a bad plate inside the battery.

 

[courchaine]

ok . So you're saying that there is not enough voltage in my battery well it seems logic i'll check into that... So that would be the reason why my battery charger at 75amps won't change anything because it only charge amps...

thanks

Max

 

[courchaine]

I've also forget to tell that when I try to bypass my selenoid the engine won't turn....well it turn but very very very slowly....

Max

 

[jasonp]

ok . So you're saying that there is not enough voltage in my battery well it seems logic i'll check into that... So that would be the reason why my battery charger at 75amps won't change anything because it only charge amps...

thanks

Max

The reason why you're battery charger can't turn over the bike is just because it doesn't have enough amperage to do so. I bet it would take a little over 125 amps to turn the warriors engine over. The battery should have around 200 to 350 amps when fully charged.
If the battery is junk then there is no way the charger will turn the engine over by itself basically. When amperage is pulled from the battery voltage drops. Basically what is happening right now is that the battery or connection is bad so voltage falls below 9 volts and this is what is used to hold the solenoid down or ON.
From what you've told me, meaning when you jump the solenoid is that the battery is bad. If the solenoid was bad and you had a fully charged battery then the engine would turn over very fast. If the engine is turning over slowy then there isn't enough amperage to turn the engine over..

 

[courchaine]

ok i'll change my battery. Thanks a lot Jason this bike is driving my crazy I cant fu$%**$% wait to ride that bitch.

Max

 

[jasonp]

no problem max! looks like you have a good ride. What made you go with the stage 2 cam?

 

[courchaine]

Well just wanted to test it a Buddy of mine get rid of his 88 warrior and give it to me in exchange of a stock one so I jumped on it and I must say that this cam really suck I think that this is maybe because of the lobe separation that the cam use because it is designed to work best with the 400 stroker I think that my stage 1 performed better than this one on low end but i can't really tell now because i've not even finished the break in so i've not tryed it full throttle.Anyway i'm trying to get rid of it and i'll go with a webcam .430 that's why i've putted the kibblewhite springs in when I rebuilded it for the second time. Well after the web will be in i'll just need a new carb and it will be done for the engine departement.

How is that TM36-68 FS perform with your setup ? as I know these carb are a pain to tune am I right ? and that must be really weird to always try to have the throttle at the good spot when hill climbing or something like that is it ?

I'm thinking about going to a CV carb maybe a z400 one but there is one of my friend who got one for a predator 500 might give it a try if it fit in the raptor 350 intake boot

 

[jasonp]

Yes the carb I have is a flat slide with the accel pump so it moves the power band up or so it feels that way and you loose a little on the bottom. The accel pump helps response you loose from it being a flat slide design, basically the lack of vaccum when the throttle is wacked open to pull fuel from the jets. You feel more connected to the engine with this carb. Also has really fine fuel metering so takes more time to get just right, but when you do it will produce more power as the mixture is closer (you can tune it in) then say other carbs. If the RPM's stay up you can stay on the throttle but if you're lugging the engine and rpm's start to fall then you have to start backing off the throttle to keep torque up and peak power at that rpm otherwise the engine will fall on it's face and want to die.
The CV will give you more torque and mid range power and just have a really nice smooth pull to it. Not super responsive carb but has very wide range of torque and broad power.

The interesting thing here is that after understanding jetting and what sounds the engine makes or what the engine does when rich or lean makes it super easy to tune. It's just another learning exprence.
I would go with ever carb kit I could find on ebay for cheap that is for the warrior. Any carb is better then what comes on there stock.

 

[courchaine]

well since I am a guy who love to go fast I want most of my power on top end so you've make me change my mind on the CV carb I'll probably look for what I can find on ebay. Maybe I'll just do like everybody and go with a edelbrock but I love to be different so maybe If I see a FCR carb or any other 38 carb I'll jump on it